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	<title>Comments on: Religion, Morality and Democracy</title>
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	<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/</link>
	<description>Bill Muehlenberg&#039;s commentary on issues of the day...</description>
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		<title>By: Julian</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-195752</link>
		<dc:creator>Julian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Jul 2010 06:49:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-195752</guid>
		<description>&quot;If there is no God, everything is permitted&quot; -Doestevesky
Julian Desouza</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;If there is no God, everything is permitted&#8221; -Doestevesky<br />
Julian Desouza</p>
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		<title>By: Glen Grady</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-178527</link>
		<dc:creator>Glen Grady</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 22 Mar 2010 03:15:39 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Probably the main reason Dawkins won&#039;t debate Creationists anymore, is because of how soundly he was beaten by the late Dr A. E. Wilder-Smith back in 1986 at the Oxford debate.
Glen Grady, Brisbane</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Probably the main reason Dawkins won&#8217;t debate Creationists anymore, is because of how soundly he was beaten by the late Dr A. E. Wilder-Smith back in 1986 at the Oxford debate.<br />
Glen Grady, Brisbane</p>
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		<title>By: Ewan</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-178192</link>
		<dc:creator>Ewan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 18 Mar 2010 02:56:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-178192</guid>
		<description>Regarding Fielding&#039;s performance on Q&amp;A, I think he was ambushed but even so that doesn&#039;t entirely excuse his performance. He didn&#039;t appear to be informed on the subject at all. I think it&#039;s partly due to his party&#039;s philosophy which actively avoids being seen to be promoting an exclusively Christian view of politics, law and morality.

Ewan McDonald, Victoria.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Regarding Fielding&#8217;s performance on Q&amp;A, I think he was ambushed but even so that doesn&#8217;t entirely excuse his performance. He didn&#8217;t appear to be informed on the subject at all. I think it&#8217;s partly due to his party&#8217;s philosophy which actively avoids being seen to be promoting an exclusively Christian view of politics, law and morality.</p>
<p>Ewan McDonald, Victoria.</p>
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		<title>By: John Thomas</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176949</link>
		<dc:creator>John Thomas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 15:11:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176949</guid>
		<description>This appelation &quot;miso-theist&quot; is absolutely right. I have long thought that Dawkins et al are not so much &lt;i&gt;atheists&lt;/i&gt; as &lt;i&gt;anti-theists&lt;/i&gt;, and anti-theism, opposition to God,  is the oldest human emotion there is; it caused &quot;the fall&quot;.
John Thomas, UK</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This appelation &#8220;miso-theist&#8221; is absolutely right. I have long thought that Dawkins et al are not so much <i>atheists</i> as <i>anti-theists</i>, and anti-theism, opposition to God,  is the oldest human emotion there is; it caused &#8220;the fall&#8221;.<br />
John Thomas, UK</p>
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		<title>By: lawrie mcnamara</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176889</link>
		<dc:creator>lawrie mcnamara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 09:48:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176889</guid>
		<description>Another good one Bill, makes me hope Abbott gets in, or at least that Rudd gets out.
Lawrie Mcnamara</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Another good one Bill, makes me hope Abbott gets in, or at least that Rudd gets out.<br />
Lawrie Mcnamara</p>
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		<title>By: david skinner</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176860</link>
		<dc:creator>david skinner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 11 Mar 2010 07:00:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176860</guid>
		<description>Forgive me Bill, but you never mentioned John Adams, the second president of the United States of America who put it well when he said:
&quot;We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.&quot;
“Our Founders had a better answer than government or even education. God is the answer. God is the moral compass of America. Or He should be, if we ever want to restore morality in our homes and civility to our land. Our Founders believed morals flowed from one’s accountability to God, and that, without God, immoral anarchy would result.” 

Davdi Skinner, UK</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Forgive me Bill, but you never mentioned John Adams, the second president of the United States of America who put it well when he said:<br />
&#8220;We have no government armed with power capable of contending with human passions unbridled by morality and religion. Avarice, ambition, revenge, or gallantry, would break the strongest cords of our Constitution as a whale goes through a net. Our Constitution was made only for a moral and religious people. It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other.&#8221;<br />
“Our Founders had a better answer than government or even education. God is the answer. God is the moral compass of America. Or He should be, if we ever want to restore morality in our homes and civility to our land. Our Founders believed morals flowed from one’s accountability to God, and that, without God, immoral anarchy would result.” </p>
<p>Davdi Skinner, UK</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Muehlenberg</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176602</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Muehlenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 06:11:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176602</guid>
		<description>Thanks again Maurice

But people like Dawkins (and maybe yourself) simply want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to insist that the world has no inherent meaning, purpose, value or telos, yet we should somehow live as if it does! Sorry, I just am not buying it. It seems far more plausible, coherent, logical and sensible to posit a moral, personal, intelligent creator to account for morality, personality, and rationality, then to try to somehow dig that up from an impersonal, amoral, aimless naturalistic system. I am afraid it takes far more faith to believe in that kind of foolishness than in the biblical account.

But as I say, evolution is not quite the main topic at hand here.

Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks again Maurice</p>
<p>But people like Dawkins (and maybe yourself) simply want to have their cake and eat it too. They want to insist that the world has no inherent meaning, purpose, value or telos, yet we should somehow live as if it does! Sorry, I just am not buying it. It seems far more plausible, coherent, logical and sensible to posit a moral, personal, intelligent creator to account for morality, personality, and rationality, then to try to somehow dig that up from an impersonal, amoral, aimless naturalistic system. I am afraid it takes far more faith to believe in that kind of foolishness than in the biblical account.</p>
<p>But as I say, evolution is not quite the main topic at hand here.</p>
<p>Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</p>
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		<title>By: Jonathan Sarfati</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176553</link>
		<dc:creator>Jonathan Sarfati</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 01:25:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176553</guid>
		<description>Evolutionist Gordy Slack said about the likes of Maurice Colbourne:

&lt;blockquote&gt;“I think it is disingenuous to argue that the origin of life is irrelevant to evolution. It is no less relevant than the Big Bang is to physics or cosmology. Evolution should be able to explain, in theory at least, all the way back to the very first organism that could replicate itself through biological or chemical processes. And to understand that organism fully, we would simply have to know what came before it. And right now we are nowhere close.” [&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.the-scientist.com/templates/trackable/display/news.jsp?type=news&amp;o_url=news/display/54759&amp;id=54759&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;What neo-creationists get right—an evolutionist shares lessons he’s learned from the Intelligent Design camp&lt;/a&gt;, &lt;i&gt;The Scientist,&lt;/i&gt; 20 June 2008.]&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Also, the origin of life is commonly referred to as “chemical evolution”.  For example, the September 1978 issue of &lt;i&gt;Scientific American&lt;/i&gt; was specially devoted to evolution, and one major article was ‘Chemical Evolution and the Origin of Life’. This stated:

&lt;blockquote&gt;“J.B.S. Haldane, the British biochemist, seems to have been the first to appreciate that a reducing atmosphere, one with no free oxygen, was a requirement for the &lt;i&gt;evolution of life from non-living organic matter.&lt;/i&gt;” [Emphasis added]&lt;/blockquote&gt;

Jonathan Sarfati, Brisbane</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Evolutionist Gordy Slack said about the likes of Maurice Colbourne:</p>
<blockquote><p>“I think it is disingenuous to argue that the origin of life is irrelevant to evolution. It is no less relevant than the Big Bang is to physics or cosmology. Evolution should be able to explain, in theory at least, all the way back to the very first organism that could replicate itself through biological or chemical processes. And to understand that organism fully, we would simply have to know what came before it. And right now we are nowhere close.” [<a href="http://www.the-scientist.com/templates/trackable/display/news.jsp?type=news&amp;o_url=news/display/54759&amp;id=54759" rel="nofollow">What neo-creationists get right—an evolutionist shares lessons he’s learned from the Intelligent Design camp</a>, <i>The Scientist,</i> 20 June 2008.]</p></blockquote>
<p>Also, the origin of life is commonly referred to as “chemical evolution”.  For example, the September 1978 issue of <i>Scientific American</i> was specially devoted to evolution, and one major article was ‘Chemical Evolution and the Origin of Life’. This stated:</p>
<blockquote><p>“J.B.S. Haldane, the British biochemist, seems to have been the first to appreciate that a reducing atmosphere, one with no free oxygen, was a requirement for the <i>evolution of life from non-living organic matter.</i>” [Emphasis added]</p></blockquote>
<p>Jonathan Sarfati, Brisbane</p>
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		<title>By: Steve Davis</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176511</link>
		<dc:creator>Steve Davis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 21:28:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176511</guid>
		<description>Maurice,
In reply to your comment dated 9/3/10 @ 7pm - refer to my first reply to you dated 9/3/10 @ 11am.
Steve Davis</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Maurice,<br />
In reply to your comment dated 9/3/10 @ 7pm &#8211; refer to my first reply to you dated 9/3/10 @ 11am.<br />
Steve Davis</p>
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		<title>By: Spencer Gear</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2010/03/07/religion-morality-and-democracy/comment-page-1/#comment-176499</link>
		<dc:creator>Spencer Gear</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:33:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=2441#comment-176499</guid>
		<description>Robert,

The example you have given of Senator Stephen Fielding&#039;s pathetic performance on ABC TV&#039;s Q &amp; A against Richard Dawkins, is a call for the Christian community to practice the requirements of Ephesians 4:11-12, where the ministry of the apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor and teacher is &quot;to equip the saints for the work of ministry.&quot;

In our robust Australian democracy, we have many opportunities for defense of the faith in the public arena. Stephen Fielding showed how he is not equipped for the job of defending the faith in a public context against one of the most articulate atheists in the world.  Surely, he should be able to say to the TV producer, &quot;I&#039;m not the best person for such a show, but I&#039;d recommend Jonathan Sarfati or [some other local defender of the faith].&quot;

Thanks for posting the link to the program.  I&#039;m embarrassed to be identified as a Christian with what Fielding said.  A pastor friend emailed me about this program and said:

&quot;Did you happen to watch Questions &amp; Answers on ABC last night - Richard Dawkins was on the panel so most of the questions were related to his field. But on the panel was Steve Fielding, the Family First Senator who (I presumed) is a born-again believer. He was absolutely abysmal, truly appalling - what an opportunity to take a stand for the Bible, for God and the Gospel. I could hardly sleep last night, going over it - just devastated. It was a &#039;field day&#039; for the atheists. It appeared that a fair percentage of the audience were Uni students, who evidently admire Dawkins. The best guy, and I don&#039;t know if he is a professing Christian, was the Labour politician and Minister for Agriculture.&quot;

Spencer Gear</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Robert,</p>
<p>The example you have given of Senator Stephen Fielding&#8217;s pathetic performance on ABC TV&#8217;s Q &amp; A against Richard Dawkins, is a call for the Christian community to practice the requirements of Ephesians 4:11-12, where the ministry of the apostle, prophet, evangelist, pastor and teacher is &#8220;to equip the saints for the work of ministry.&#8221;</p>
<p>In our robust Australian democracy, we have many opportunities for defense of the faith in the public arena. Stephen Fielding showed how he is not equipped for the job of defending the faith in a public context against one of the most articulate atheists in the world.  Surely, he should be able to say to the TV producer, &#8220;I&#8217;m not the best person for such a show, but I&#8217;d recommend Jonathan Sarfati or [some other local defender of the faith].&#8221;</p>
<p>Thanks for posting the link to the program.  I&#8217;m embarrassed to be identified as a Christian with what Fielding said.  A pastor friend emailed me about this program and said:</p>
<p>&#8220;Did you happen to watch Questions &amp; Answers on ABC last night &#8211; Richard Dawkins was on the panel so most of the questions were related to his field. But on the panel was Steve Fielding, the Family First Senator who (I presumed) is a born-again believer. He was absolutely abysmal, truly appalling &#8211; what an opportunity to take a stand for the Bible, for God and the Gospel. I could hardly sleep last night, going over it &#8211; just devastated. It was a &#8216;field day&#8217; for the atheists. It appeared that a fair percentage of the audience were Uni students, who evidently admire Dawkins. The best guy, and I don&#8217;t know if he is a professing Christian, was the Labour politician and Minister for Agriculture.&#8221;</p>
<p>Spencer Gear</p>
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