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	<title>Comments on: Abortion and Civil Disobedience</title>
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	<description>Bill Muehlenberg&#039;s commentary on issues of the day...</description>
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		<title>By: Pat Gartlan</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-138123</link>
		<dc:creator>Pat Gartlan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 May 2009 00:49:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-138123</guid>
		<description>Probably most of the present adult generation regard abortion as part of life and many are compromised by having had abortions or been part of another&#039;s decision to do so. At the mention of abortion they determinedly shut their eyes and ears to protect their hearts and, in some cases, their sanity.

Our best hope is to educate the next generation. We need to create in them a sense of wonder about life in the womb which leads them to regard abortion as a dreadful thing. 
 
I suggest high quality portable displays showing the first days of life, displays with the ‘wow’ factor, a joy to visit, especially for children. Abortion would not feature in the display. 

Suitable for public spaces like shopping centres and schools, they should be managed by bright young adults. I am aware that this idea is not new, but done Australia wide, it could be powerful.

Pat Gartlan</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Probably most of the present adult generation regard abortion as part of life and many are compromised by having had abortions or been part of another&#8217;s decision to do so. At the mention of abortion they determinedly shut their eyes and ears to protect their hearts and, in some cases, their sanity.</p>
<p>Our best hope is to educate the next generation. We need to create in them a sense of wonder about life in the womb which leads them to regard abortion as a dreadful thing. </p>
<p>I suggest high quality portable displays showing the first days of life, displays with the ‘wow’ factor, a joy to visit, especially for children. Abortion would not feature in the display. </p>
<p>Suitable for public spaces like shopping centres and schools, they should be managed by bright young adults. I am aware that this idea is not new, but done Australia wide, it could be powerful.</p>
<p>Pat Gartlan</p>
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		<title>By: Louise Le Mottee, Hobart</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-138041</link>
		<dc:creator>Louise Le Mottee, Hobart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 11:36:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-138041</guid>
		<description>The world needs the Gospel of Our Lord Jesus Christ. We need to make disciples.

Abortion is the single biggest social issue today, with somewhere between 50,000 and 100,000 little Australians being killed every year. One of the reasons we need to keep this issue before us is to become true disciples ourselves and thus enabling us to be able to make more disciples. We must never become accustomed to this evil in our midst. In this way we can stay fired up. We must, of course, do all that we possibly can to help the defenceless and for some of us it may mean civil disobedience, but most of us are just not in that position yet. The healthcare workers in Victoria *are* in that position and if I were in their shoes, I ought to be prepared to go to gaol for refusing to partake in an abortion procedure. I&#039;m not in that position, so it&#039;s a bit academic.

Suffice it to say that if the Media were not so completely in favour of abortion, it would have been essentially defeated years ago. That&#039;s a big part of where the battle lies.

But it&#039;s a both/and scenario - we need to fight for just laws (and remember, most of these evil laws are passing by very narrow margins) AND look to change hearts and provide help to pregnant women etc.

Louise Le Mottee, Hobart</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The world needs the Gospel of Our Lord Jesus Christ. We need to make disciples.</p>
<p>Abortion is the single biggest social issue today, with somewhere between 50,000 and 100,000 little Australians being killed every year. One of the reasons we need to keep this issue before us is to become true disciples ourselves and thus enabling us to be able to make more disciples. We must never become accustomed to this evil in our midst. In this way we can stay fired up. We must, of course, do all that we possibly can to help the defenceless and for some of us it may mean civil disobedience, but most of us are just not in that position yet. The healthcare workers in Victoria *are* in that position and if I were in their shoes, I ought to be prepared to go to gaol for refusing to partake in an abortion procedure. I&#8217;m not in that position, so it&#8217;s a bit academic.</p>
<p>Suffice it to say that if the Media were not so completely in favour of abortion, it would have been essentially defeated years ago. That&#8217;s a big part of where the battle lies.</p>
<p>But it&#8217;s a both/and scenario &#8211; we need to fight for just laws (and remember, most of these evil laws are passing by very narrow margins) AND look to change hearts and provide help to pregnant women etc.</p>
<p>Louise Le Mottee, Hobart</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Marks</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137992</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Marks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 May 2009 03:35:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137992</guid>
		<description>Ewan, I am sorry if I gave the impression that civil disobedience was not acceptable as that was not my intention. I have found time and time again that the secret to all action is to first find out the will of God and that won&#039;t happen unless we get serious about prayer.

I would love to see at least a monthy time of prayer for everyone who wants to get serious about praying for God&#039;s direction about the murder of the unborn. I would like to see one in every town and city, because THIS IS SERIOUS!!! and we need to get angry (righteous of course). 

If we had a central administration where every meeting could pass on what they felt God was saying and then have it sent out via an eletter to everyone involved.

Roger Marks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ewan, I am sorry if I gave the impression that civil disobedience was not acceptable as that was not my intention. I have found time and time again that the secret to all action is to first find out the will of God and that won&#8217;t happen unless we get serious about prayer.</p>
<p>I would love to see at least a monthy time of prayer for everyone who wants to get serious about praying for God&#8217;s direction about the murder of the unborn. I would like to see one in every town and city, because THIS IS SERIOUS!!! and we need to get angry (righteous of course). </p>
<p>If we had a central administration where every meeting could pass on what they felt God was saying and then have it sent out via an eletter to everyone involved.</p>
<p>Roger Marks</p>
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		<title>By: Tom Wise</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137728</link>
		<dc:creator>Tom Wise</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 11 May 2009 06:27:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137728</guid>
		<description>For Thirty years my wife and I struggled to get churches (really THE CHURCH) to work together, to Stand Up and Speak Up. As I understand it, we are supposed to be the Body, with Christ the Head. We have found few who could see the picture of what could happen if we really believed and acted.  The early apostles counted it joy to be imprisoned or die for standing up for the Truth. Christ is the Way, the Life and The Truth.
Tom Wise</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For Thirty years my wife and I struggled to get churches (really THE CHURCH) to work together, to Stand Up and Speak Up. As I understand it, we are supposed to be the Body, with Christ the Head. We have found few who could see the picture of what could happen if we really believed and acted.  The early apostles counted it joy to be imprisoned or die for standing up for the Truth. Christ is the Way, the Life and The Truth.<br />
Tom Wise</p>
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		<title>By: ben from bendigo (registered Nurse)</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137646</link>
		<dc:creator>ben from bendigo (registered Nurse)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 11:15:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137646</guid>
		<description>Amen Roger Marks You have hit the mark. Like you said its ok to pray ie for us to do the talking. But we have to recognize that were are talking to the man who knows everything and the outcome of everything. God knew this was going to happen and he knows how to stop it. We need to stop long enough to hear what he has to say about this issue then be obedient to what he says. When we read about joshua God had already developed a plan to defeat Jericho. Running around a city seven times with a bunch of priests doesnt make a lick of sense and is something that they dont teach at pukapunyal military school. But then were not following worldly knowledge but Godly wisdom. The bible says that wisdom is the principle thing. I sincerely believe that just one believer has the ability to change the entire outcome of the abortion issue if he or she will faithfully follow God step by step. Yes backed by corporate prayer daily.
Benjamin Veitz </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Amen Roger Marks You have hit the mark. Like you said its ok to pray ie for us to do the talking. But we have to recognize that were are talking to the man who knows everything and the outcome of everything. God knew this was going to happen and he knows how to stop it. We need to stop long enough to hear what he has to say about this issue then be obedient to what he says. When we read about joshua God had already developed a plan to defeat Jericho. Running around a city seven times with a bunch of priests doesnt make a lick of sense and is something that they dont teach at pukapunyal military school. But then were not following worldly knowledge but Godly wisdom. The bible says that wisdom is the principle thing. I sincerely believe that just one believer has the ability to change the entire outcome of the abortion issue if he or she will faithfully follow God step by step. Yes backed by corporate prayer daily.<br />
Benjamin Veitz</p>
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		<title>By: Ewan</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137645</link>
		<dc:creator>Ewan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 10:59:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137645</guid>
		<description>Roger is right about the importance of prayer and that it is greatly underused in much of the church today, but more prayer shouldn&#039;t necessarily mean less protesting (against abortion). In fact if the church were to pray more what should happen is that the church comes into closer alignment with God&#039;s will and would more clearly see things from His perspective which would then lead to more action.

Remember also the words of John Wesley, &quot;Pray as if it all depends on God, and work as if it all depends on you.&quot;

Ewan McDonald.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Roger is right about the importance of prayer and that it is greatly underused in much of the church today, but more prayer shouldn&#8217;t necessarily mean less protesting (against abortion). In fact if the church were to pray more what should happen is that the church comes into closer alignment with God&#8217;s will and would more clearly see things from His perspective which would then lead to more action.</p>
<p>Remember also the words of John Wesley, &#8220;Pray as if it all depends on God, and work as if it all depends on you.&#8221;</p>
<p>Ewan McDonald.</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Muehlenberg</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137617</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Muehlenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 03:38:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137617</guid>
		<description>Thanks for the kind words Richard.

Yes I was interviewed this morning about the IntelliGender test. I said it would not only lead to more designer babies, but would result in more abortions for perfectly healthy unborn babies who are of the “wrong” gender. It is just another step to a Brave New World.

Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for the kind words Richard.</p>
<p>Yes I was interviewed this morning about the IntelliGender test. I said it would not only lead to more designer babies, but would result in more abortions for perfectly healthy unborn babies who are of the “wrong” gender. It is just another step to a Brave New World.</p>
<p>Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</p>
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		<title>By: Roger Marks</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137610</link>
		<dc:creator>Roger Marks</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 02:51:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137610</guid>
		<description>In 2 Corinthians 10:4 it says “The weapons we fight with are not weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. And we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience, once your obedience is complete.”

From this we deduce that God has given us the weapons we need to defeat the enemy. All we have to do is to use them.

What is probably the greatest weapon we have as sons of God?

Lots of singing?
Powerful preaching?
Enthusiasm?
A college degree?
Good leaders?
Maintaining the status quo?
Saying that we believe the bible is the Word of God? 

The fact is, it is none of the above. Our greatest weapon is prayer. Through prayer we can accomplish victory over Satan, which is why he doesn’t want us to do it. Meeting once a week for an hour to pray is not prayer.

The New Testament Church met daily to pray. One hour a week!! Makes me feel ashamed.

Satan has many strongholds in society such as the education system, homosexuals, feminism, alternative families, child abuse, and the biggest one of all, the murder of millions of babies in the womb. Governments are frantically running around trying to cope with the onslaught. The end result is zilch. Moral degradation is happening every day and is going to get worse because the church does not pray. 

When we pray, we are saying we don’t have the answers. We are asking God to equip us for the battle. Most prayer meetings we tell God our problems but rarely listen to his answers. We certainly don’t want to know his plans for his kingdom. It seems that the fact that we have met for prayer is sufficient. Whether anything happens seems irrelevant.

We seem to treat prayer as just one part of our religious programme, instead of making it the most important part of our gathering together. The part that should take priority over everything else. 

I know of one church where the leadership prays for 10 minutes a month when they meet together. Is the church growing? Is the church fulfilling its commission? Not a hope in hell, or heaven. 

You can go to jail for injuring or killing a dog. The government pays you to kill your baby. That will not change until the church takes up its most powerful weapon of prayer, corporately, until it hurts. That will save more babies lives than any other activity.

One final point, people say “well, I pray at home for these things.” Fine, keep doing it but you cannot escape that most of the prayer in the New Testament Church was corporate. Why is this? Simple. The scripture teaches there is power in numbers and even more when they are in unity.

Roger Marks</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In 2 Corinthians 10:4 it says “The weapons we fight with are not weapons of the world. On the contrary, they have divine power to demolish strongholds. We demolish arguments and every pretension that sets itself up against the knowledge of God, and we take captive every thought to make it obedient to Christ. And we will be ready to punish every act of disobedience, once your obedience is complete.”</p>
<p>From this we deduce that God has given us the weapons we need to defeat the enemy. All we have to do is to use them.</p>
<p>What is probably the greatest weapon we have as sons of God?</p>
<p>Lots of singing?<br />
Powerful preaching?<br />
Enthusiasm?<br />
A college degree?<br />
Good leaders?<br />
Maintaining the status quo?<br />
Saying that we believe the bible is the Word of God? </p>
<p>The fact is, it is none of the above. Our greatest weapon is prayer. Through prayer we can accomplish victory over Satan, which is why he doesn’t want us to do it. Meeting once a week for an hour to pray is not prayer.</p>
<p>The New Testament Church met daily to pray. One hour a week!! Makes me feel ashamed.</p>
<p>Satan has many strongholds in society such as the education system, homosexuals, feminism, alternative families, child abuse, and the biggest one of all, the murder of millions of babies in the womb. Governments are frantically running around trying to cope with the onslaught. The end result is zilch. Moral degradation is happening every day and is going to get worse because the church does not pray. </p>
<p>When we pray, we are saying we don’t have the answers. We are asking God to equip us for the battle. Most prayer meetings we tell God our problems but rarely listen to his answers. We certainly don’t want to know his plans for his kingdom. It seems that the fact that we have met for prayer is sufficient. Whether anything happens seems irrelevant.</p>
<p>We seem to treat prayer as just one part of our religious programme, instead of making it the most important part of our gathering together. The part that should take priority over everything else. </p>
<p>I know of one church where the leadership prays for 10 minutes a month when they meet together. Is the church growing? Is the church fulfilling its commission? Not a hope in hell, or heaven. </p>
<p>You can go to jail for injuring or killing a dog. The government pays you to kill your baby. That will not change until the church takes up its most powerful weapon of prayer, corporately, until it hurts. That will save more babies lives than any other activity.</p>
<p>One final point, people say “well, I pray at home for these things.” Fine, keep doing it but you cannot escape that most of the prayer in the New Testament Church was corporate. Why is this? Simple. The scripture teaches there is power in numbers and even more when they are in unity.</p>
<p>Roger Marks</p>
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		<title>By: Richard Blake</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137607</link>
		<dc:creator>Richard Blake</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 10 May 2009 02:31:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137607</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re awesome bill, I am truly your biggest fan!
As you know i believe abortion is to believers today as was slavery, womens rights, care for the disabled and workers rights for the believers of the past.

I saw this morning that we will soon see the release of an over the counter test for the sex of a child as young as 8 weeks. The first right of a women is the right to life, and it looks like Australia is introducing its own form of the one child policy.

I wonder if anyone is interested in a sister protest at the Perth campus of Notre Dame?

Richard Blake</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re awesome bill, I am truly your biggest fan!<br />
As you know i believe abortion is to believers today as was slavery, womens rights, care for the disabled and workers rights for the believers of the past.</p>
<p>I saw this morning that we will soon see the release of an over the counter test for the sex of a child as young as 8 weeks. The first right of a women is the right to life, and it looks like Australia is introducing its own form of the one child policy.</p>
<p>I wonder if anyone is interested in a sister protest at the Perth campus of Notre Dame?</p>
<p>Richard Blake</p>
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		<title>By: Bill Muehlenberg</title>
		<link>http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2009/05/06/abortion-and-civil-disobedience/comment-page-2/#comment-137551</link>
		<dc:creator>Bill Muehlenberg</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 09 May 2009 05:35:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/?p=1475#comment-137551</guid>
		<description>Thanks guys

The number of Catholic Bishops publicly opposing Notre Dame’s honouring of pro-abortion Obama continues to climb. Now there are a total of 71. Go Bishops! http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/may/09050815.html 

Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks guys</p>
<p>The number of Catholic Bishops publicly opposing Notre Dame’s honouring of pro-abortion Obama continues to climb. Now there are a total of 71. Go Bishops! <a href="http://www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/may/09050815.html" rel="nofollow">www.lifesitenews.com/ldn/2009/may/09050815.html</a> </p>
<p>Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch</p>
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