I am aware of the sort of things you describe in the Emerging Church. Liberal theology, or sometimes worse, has a tendency to be purported in some emerging churches. Leaders of the movement in America (Brian McLaren, Rob Bell, Doug Pagitt, others…) are being carefully examined by the likes of Mark Driscoll and John Piper. Often their assessments are less than favourable. However, it is difficult to draw conclusions about the movement as a whole; as I have said, it is not coherent.

Simon Kennedy, VIC

I guess I would say that the rise in sexual sin and divorce in churches is in direct proportion to the ’solidity’ of teaching that comes across the pulpit. There seem to be plenty of examples of churches today that have strayed from the core teaching of our continual need for a Saviour and our transformation through death to our own flesh, in favour of ‘fixing’ our flesh so we are better, happier, wealthier people. The focus seems to be more on the self-actualisation of the believer through the power of the Holy Spirit and ‘gifts’, than servanthood, evangelism, and teaching of the resurrected Christ.

Garth Penglase

I know a bit about Mike Frost. He seems, from my experience, a pretty solid bible teacher and a good thinker. He is a part of what is mostly referred to as the ‘Emerging Church’, which is not so much a coherent movement, as it is a cultural shift in the way church is “done”. Emerging Church could be seen as seeker sensitive, I guess. It has elements of it. It is also a bit controversial as some people in the movement are using some questionable theology, not necessarily Frost though!

I wouldn’t describe Frost as following a “seeker-sensitive” style. He is more interested in connecting through culture and being in the community and so forth. He has a book called “Exiles” which might be worth reading.

Simon Kennedy, VIC

Yes I used to be the same. As a young believer I was a zealous defender of truth and orthodoxy, and was willing to challenge anyone and anything, often in a most arrogant and un-Christlike manner. I still believe truth and orthodoxy are terribly important and incredibly vital, but I have learned, over the years, to be a bit more gracious, a bit more loving and a bit more humble when it comes to others and their beliefs. Yes, I will always stand for truth, but I have learned to be a bit more forbearing where it is possible, yet hopefully not at the expense of truth and the gospel. As I say, it is a very tough balance to achieve, yet that is what we are called to do: “speak the truth in love” (Eph. 4:15).

My earlier days as a believer are nicely represented in the following humorous episode:

Walking across a bridge, I saw a man on the edge, about to jump. I ran over and said: “Stop. Don’t do it.”
“Why not?” he asked.
“Well, there’s so much to live for!”
“Like what?”
“Are you religious?”
He said: “Yes.”
I said: “Me too. Are you Christian or Buddhist?”
“Christian.”
“Me, too. Are you Catholic or Protestant?”
“Protestant.”
“Me, too. Are you Episcopalian or Baptist?”
“Baptist.”
“Me, too. Are you Baptist Church of God or Church of the Lord?”
“Baptist Church of God.”
“Me, too. Are you original Baptist Church of God, or Reformed Baptist Church of God?”
“Reformed Baptist Church of God.”
“Me, too! Are you Reformed Baptist Church of God, Reformation of 1879, or Reformed Baptist
Church of God, Reformation of 1915?”
He said: “Reformation of 1915.”
I said: “Die, heretic scum,” and pushed him off.

Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch

As a young Christian I was one of the most critical people you’d come across, all in the name of truth. Many years later all I can say is that the major truth I’ve learnt is just how much I am constantly in need of a Saviour.
While I love truth, and hate the way Satan uses part-truths to deceive and bring so much damage within churches, and while it is true that ‘by their fruit they shall be known’, I’ve also realised that there is another truth: we are judged in the same way that we judge others (Matt 7:1-2), and it is dangerous to judge someone until you have a walked in their shoes. (Heb 12:15 & Gal 6:7)

I just pray that when I speak or write about something that I get it right in critiquing the action or the method, and not the person or their motives of which only God knows the truth.

Garth Penglase

Yes you have basically stated some of my concerns. Getting the balance right is always extremely difficult. We must discern and test all things, and challenge false doctrine, and so on. But I think we are far too ready to publicly criticise and condemn other believers, when the biblical pattern is to go to them first in private, as in Matt. 18, to consider ourselves, as in Gal. 6, etc.

I did raise WCCC and Hybels of course, partly because this was already in the public domain. And my intent was not to dump on them or publicly criticise them, but simply to point out what appeared to be an important rethink.

As I said in an earlier comment, it was not my intention that we now start naming all kinds of other leaders and churches, and engage in some sort of heresy hunting exercise. There can be a place for that, but again, caution and humility is the order of the day.

The balance is very hard to get right, and I don’t think I have got it right yet. Far from it. Perhaps I should just add more to my articles and comments that when I critique someone or some belief or practice, that I always remind my readers to pray for those concerned.

We are all fallen and fallible and out of the will of God at times, so we need real humility and care when we discuss others. I know I do discuss many others on this site, and I often need to pray for wisdom and guidance in what I write and how I write. As I say, I do not have it all right yet, and would covet your prayers as I continue in this ministry. Unity is very important, and so too is truth. The balance is always difficult to achieve.

And the link you provided Garth is quite good. It takes pretty much the same line that I do on these things. Its conclusion is worth reprinting here:

“CONCLUSION
If you feel you are called to a ministry of discernment, take heed of these principles, and be wary of ‘touching the Lord’s anointed’ (1 Samuel 24:6). King David knew better than to attack Saul, even though he was a poor king. Many preachers and ministries today DO need correction and input, but if all we do is call them heretics rather than humbly entreating them to change, with little desire other than to warn people away from them, we may be approaching the subject in a way that displeases God. Now, sometimes, we should warn people away, but we should be sure to be majoring on the majors, not the minors, or as it is said:
In the essentials, UNITY. In the non-essentials, LIBERTY. In all things, CHARITY.”

Bill Muehlenberg, CultureWatch

And I think it is fair to say that mega churches are often characterised by their programatic and research-driven, seeker-friendly approach which seems rather contrary to what I understand about the Body of Christ being *led* by the Holy Spirit. It seems to me that there is a sure model provided for us in the scriptures and promoted by the Holy Spirit as to how to reach the lost and disciple the found. And it doesn’t look much like what I see today in many churches. How to conduct church can have a myriad of expressions I’m sure, but the focus and content should be pretty much the same.

But one of the things that pains me the most is seeing Christians at war with each other, seeing public criticism of methods and doctrines when we should be striving for unity. A good example was when the two Dannys were convicted for religious vilification in Victoria and people *within* the Christian church came out against them. This should not happen. Often the greatest persecution of Christians comes from those purporting to be Christians themselves.

So let’s be slow to criticise and fast to forgive. I believe the “10 Principles to Biblical Discernment” posted here http://www.twoorthree.net/2006/08/watchbloggers.html is a good place to start, which, at Number 2, has the warning “Make sure you have sufficient, credible, PERSONAL knowledge of those you criticize”.

I do agree that it’s important to speak out against incorrect doctrine and charlatans etc., but let’s err on the side of caution when speaking against anyone who could be considered the Lord’s anointed 1 Samuel 24:6. Yes, the rot set into many of these churches many years ago and there have been many people calling for truth and change. But we should be seeking to ‘bear each others burdens’ and praying for each other, grief-stricken when one of our own falls, and there to lend a hand in helping them recover their feet. If we aren’t then its probably fair to say that we haven’t earned the right to criticise the person. So particularly when we there is an attempt at changing direction let’s encourage and guide, and pray for them that they may hear God’s voice.

Garth Penglase

Ewan McDonald, Victoria.