Comments on: Worth getting shook up about http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/ Bill Muehlenberg's commentary on issues of the day... Sat, 11 Feb 2012 01:43:44 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.2.1 By: Frank Gashumba http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-644 Frank Gashumba Thu, 07 Sep 2006 12:30:25 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-644 John, you seem to be applying a standard of morality by which you find Christians, or those who condemn homosexuality, to have fallen short. But what is this standard of morality you apply, and from where does it derive its authority? Is it a transcendant standard, and therefore absolute and universally binding in its authority? Or is it arbitrary and subjective, and therefore relative? Frank Gashumba, Melbourne John, you seem to be applying a standard of morality by which you find Christians, or those who condemn homosexuality, to have fallen short.

But what is this standard of morality you apply, and from where does it derive its authority?

Is it a transcendant standard, and therefore absolute and universally binding in its authority?

Or is it arbitrary and subjective, and therefore relative?

Frank Gashumba, Melbourne

]]> By: Andrew Forbes http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-140 Andrew Forbes Thu, 25 May 2006 23:27:44 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-140 Dear John Please stop using yourself as an example to throw a blanket statement over ALL homosexual relaionships. While this may be in your personal experience it is certainly not the case for the other 99.9% of homosexuals. The fact is that numerous studies show the health risks of homosexuality. In the West homosexual males are much more likely to have AIDS, around 8 times more likely to have <span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Verdana; mso-fareast-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-bidi-font-family: 'Times New Roman'; mso-ansi-language: EN-US; mso-fareast-language: EN-US; mso-bidi-language: AR-SA">hepatitis</span>, around 14 times more likely to have syphilis ect..... How is this healthy? I agree that it is sad that so many commit suicide too, but again don't just point out the 'gay' teenagers, Australia has one of the highest male teen suicide rates in the world, with Bayside ranked the highest of all suburbs. This is a problem that will not go away by just focusing on gay/confused young men. Andrew Forbes, Melbourne Dear John
Please stop using yourself as an example to throw a blanket statement over ALL homosexual relaionships. While this may be in your personal experience it is certainly not the case for the other 99.9% of homosexuals.

The fact is that numerous studies show the health risks of homosexuality. In the West homosexual males are much more likely to have AIDS, around 8 times more likely to have hepatitis, around 14 times more likely to have syphilis ect…..

How is this healthy?

I agree that it is sad that so many commit suicide too, but again don’t just point out the ‘gay’ teenagers, Australia has one of the highest male teen suicide rates in the world, with Bayside ranked the highest of all suburbs. This is a problem that will not go away by just focusing on gay/confused young men.

Andrew Forbes, Melbourne

]]> By: David Clay http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-58 David Clay Tue, 16 May 2006 07:44:41 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-58 Sorry John K, but you do have it all wrong. Some people have a natural tendency to violence, but that does not at all make it right. Some people have a tendency to lust, but that does not make pornography right, even when they 'don't hurt other people'. If our Creator and Lawgiver God has told us it is wrong, it is wrong. What are you going to say to Him when you stand before Him on Judgment Day? Jesus forgave the woman caught in adultery, but He also said to her "Go and sin no more". God will forgive a homosexual for the homosexual acts he or she have committed if they truly repent, but if there is no repentance, then mark my words, they will be judged. In a world that has fallen because of the rebellion of us people against God, we will struggle with temptations and tendencies to do evil things. But God has provided a way through His Son Jesus, to rescue us from our sin, to cleanse us anew, and sent His Holy Spirit to work in our lives so that we can turn away from sin and live a life that is pure before God. That's real truth for you, truth that will set you free. David Clay, Melbourne Sorry John K, but you do have it all wrong. Some people have a natural tendency to violence, but that does not at all make it right. Some people have a tendency to lust, but that does not make pornography right, even when they ‘don’t hurt other people’. If our Creator and Lawgiver God has told us it is wrong, it is wrong. What are you going to say to Him when you stand before Him on Judgment Day? Jesus forgave the woman caught in adultery, but He also said to her “Go and sin no more”. God will forgive a homosexual for the homosexual acts he or she have committed if they truly repent, but if there is no repentance, then mark my words, they will be judged. In a world that has fallen because of the rebellion of us people against God, we will struggle with temptations and tendencies to do evil things. But God has provided a way through His Son Jesus, to rescue us from our sin, to cleanse us anew, and sent His Holy Spirit to work in our lives so that we can turn away from sin and live a life that is pure before God.
That’s real truth for you, truth that will set you free.

David Clay, Melbourne

]]> By: Frank Jetmar http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-45 Frank Jetmar Mon, 15 May 2006 15:17:06 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-45 Dear John, you wrote that homosexuality is natural and healthy. But two men or two women having sex is un-natural and goes against the design of a man and a woman. You only have to look at the design of human beings in a natural sense. Man was designed to go into Woman for the purpose of procreation. A man's organ was not designed to go into another man. This is both un-natural and unclean. The homosexual life is one of the most dangerous lifestyles that a person can live. Homosexual men suffer from far higher rates of HIV/AIDS and an AIDS patient spends on average 4 months in hospital at a cost of $80,000. In the 1997/98 financial year, for which I have statistics, HIV/AIDS treatment cost the taxpayer $59 million, more than 2% of the total cost of the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme. Our health care system is already suffering due to a lack of funds. The findings of a survey released in 2002, stated that Nationally HIV infection rate had levelled out, but in Victoria cases among homosexual men had risen 88% since 1999. The Victorian health minister at that time, John Thwaites, launched an urgent safe sex campaign in response to these alarming figures. The Victorian HIV lobbyists at the time were loathed to admit that the United States gay subculture of "barebacking" - a term used by gay men who choose to have anal sex without using condoms, may have been the reason for the increase of HIV/AIDS infection in Victoria. Homosexual men suffer from far greater rates of chemical dependency, depression, disease and suicide than their heterosexual counterparts. Do a Google or Yahoo search and look on homosexual websites and you will see that they give out these statistics as facts. As far as some Christians go, they have been wrong in respect to the way they have treated homosexuals. I have a video of a homosexual guy speaking in a church. His name is Sy Rogers and he was a candidate for a gender change until they shut the program down. In this video he points out the shortcomings of Christians toward homosexuals and tells his life story. I think you would find it very interesting. I will mail it to you if you like. You don’t need to give me your home address, I will be glad to send it to one of your friends or you local post office for you to pick up. There will be no charge. Let me know if you are interested. Frank Jetmar, Melbourne Dear John, you wrote that homosexuality is natural and healthy. But two men or two women having sex is un-natural and goes against the design of a man and a woman. You only have to look at the design of human beings in a natural sense. Man was designed to go into Woman for the purpose of procreation. A man’s organ was not designed to go into another man. This is both un-natural and unclean.

The homosexual life is one of the most dangerous lifestyles that a person can live. Homosexual men suffer from far higher rates of HIV/AIDS and an AIDS patient spends on average 4 months in hospital at a cost of $80,000. In the 1997/98 financial year, for which I have statistics, HIV/AIDS treatment cost the taxpayer $59 million, more than 2% of the total cost of the Pharmaceutical Benefits Scheme. Our health care system is already suffering due to a lack of funds.

The findings of a survey released in 2002, stated that Nationally HIV infection rate had levelled out, but in Victoria cases among homosexual men had risen 88% since 1999. The Victorian health minister at that time, John Thwaites, launched an urgent safe sex campaign in response to these alarming figures. The Victorian HIV lobbyists at the time were loathed to admit that the United States gay subculture of “barebacking” – a term used by gay men who choose to have anal sex without using condoms, may have been the reason for the increase of HIV/AIDS infection in Victoria.

Homosexual men suffer from far greater rates of chemical dependency, depression, disease and suicide than their heterosexual counterparts. Do a Google or Yahoo search and look on homosexual websites and you will see that they give out these statistics as facts.

As far as some Christians go, they have been wrong in respect to the way they have treated homosexuals. I have a video of a homosexual guy speaking in a church. His name is Sy Rogers and he was a candidate for a gender change until they shut the program down. In this video he points out the shortcomings of Christians toward homosexuals and tells his life story. I think you would find it very interesting. I will mail it to you if you like. You don’t need to give me your home address, I will be glad to send it to one of your friends or you local post office for you to pick up. There will be no charge. Let me know if you are interested.

Frank Jetmar, Melbourne

]]> By: John Kloprogge http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-30 John Kloprogge Sat, 13 May 2006 04:05:38 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-30 Frank. Let me explain. But first, let me say this. Being "gay" is not a "lifestyle"; it is a life. It is not unnatural or unhealthy. I am of perfect health, and intend to stay this way (I don't drink, smoke, or have promiscuous or unprotected sex). You may also not realise that homosexuality has always existed, in every country, and in every species. It is natural for many people. It is natural for me, it is normal for me. Fundamentalist Christians do tremendous damage by telling gay kids that there's something wrong with them. They hurt them by suggesting they "threaten society and the family". They screw up their minds by encouraging them to become straight. Is it any wonder that 30% of youth suicides are gay teens? The condemnation of them by certain people causes immense psychological harm, and encourages hatred and intolerance in others. That's truth for you. John Kloprogge, North Croyden Frank. Let me explain.

But first, let me say this. Being “gay” is not a “lifestyle”; it is a life. It is not unnatural or unhealthy. I am of perfect health, and intend to stay this way (I don’t drink, smoke, or have promiscuous or unprotected sex). You may also not realise that homosexuality has always existed, in every country, and in every species. It is natural for many people. It is natural for me, it is normal for me.

Fundamentalist Christians do tremendous damage by telling gay kids that there’s something wrong with them. They hurt them by suggesting they “threaten society and the family”. They screw up their minds by encouraging them to become straight. Is it any wonder that 30% of youth suicides are gay teens? The condemnation of them by certain people causes immense psychological harm, and encourages hatred and intolerance in others.

That’s truth for you.

John Kloprogge, North Croyden

]]> By: Frank Jetmar http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-24 Frank Jetmar Wed, 10 May 2006 15:12:52 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-24 Dear John K, you wrote, "When will fundamentalist Christians wake up and see the damage they are doing to vulnerable gay teenagers on the brink of suicide?" What damage are you talking about? Speaking the truth perhaps, that homsexuality is an unnatural and unhealthy lifestyle and that homosexuals can live normal lives if they choose to? Frank Jetmar, Melbourne Dear John K, you wrote, “When will fundamentalist Christians wake up and see the damage they are doing to vulnerable gay teenagers on the brink of suicide?” What damage are you talking about? Speaking the truth perhaps, that homsexuality is an unnatural and unhealthy lifestyle and that homosexuals can live normal lives if they choose to?

Frank Jetmar, Melbourne

]]> By: John Kloprogge http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/comment-page-1/#comment-20 John Kloprogge Mon, 01 May 2006 09:58:29 +0000 http://www.billmuehlenberg.com/2006/03/14/worth-getting-shook-up-about/#comment-20 Indeed, certain activists groups are targetting children, to manipulate and brainwash them. This includes many churches. When will fundamentalist Christians will wake up and see the damage they are doing to vulnerable gay teenagers on the brink of suicide? On the issue of migration to the Netherland, I'd paraphrase John Howard: "The Netherlands should decide who comes to their country, and the circumstances in which they come." John Kloprogge, North Croydon Indeed, certain activists groups are targetting children, to manipulate and brainwash them. This includes many churches.

When will fundamentalist Christians will wake up and see the damage they are doing to vulnerable gay teenagers on the brink of suicide?

On the issue of migration to the Netherland, I’d paraphrase John Howard:

“The Netherlands should decide who comes to their country, and the circumstances in which they come.”

John Kloprogge, North Croydon

]]>